2 guys missing in Victoria?

[chook]

Details from the ABC website.Search and rescue authorities are sweeping the Kinglake National Park north-east of Melbourne, after a gyrocopter carrying two men vanished yesterday.The men took off from a conference centre on the Melba Highway at Dixon"s Creek just before 5:30pm yesterday.Their flight was expected to last 15 minutes but they failed to arrive at their planned destination.Emergency services were notified and search and rescue police, including the air wing, scoured Kinglake National Park overnight but failed to find any sign of the men, or the aircraft.The search continued this morning, accompanied by SES volunteers.UPDATE - The passenger is believed to be a Singaporean tourist.

[Waddles]

Report confirmed by Aus-Sar this morning. Two persons deceased. No more details released at this time. We have offered assistance to the Vic Police and have yet to be advised if our presence is required.Allan Wardill

[Tsemler]

Has Victoria police taken up ASRA"s offer of assistance?What type of gyro was it?

[Brian]

ASRA officials conducted a inspection today [ Monday]. The gyro is a MTO sport. A tragedy to say the least. Christmas is going to be a bleak affiar for those familis involved.

[RickE]

Have there been any preliminary findings as to the cause of this tragedy or is it too soon. I only met the pilot a few weeks ago and by all accounts was an accomplished pilot/instructor.

[Waddles]

Gidday All,The gyro has since been identified as an MTO 3 model, not the sport as we were initially told. On site investigation complete, but waiting on more information from the Police before completing a report.The engine was stopped before the gyro entered a heavily wooded area, collided with the tops of tall trees and fell to the ground. The coroner has ordered an engine strip in the hope of finding the cause of the failure. Other obvious engine systems have been eliminated as the cause. Met conditions were conducive to carby icing and that possibility is still being looked at.Allan Wardill.

[aussie_paul]

Gidday All,The gyro has since been identified as an MTO 3 model, not the sport as we were initially told. On site investigation complete, but waiting on more information from the Police before completing a report.The engine was stopped before the gyro entered a heavily wooded area, collided with the tops of tall trees and fell to the ground. The coroner has ordered an engine strip in the hope of finding the cause of the failure. Other obvious engine systems have been eliminated as the cause. Met conditions were conducive to carby icing and that possibility is still being looked at.Allan Wardill.Thanks Allan. I know I am a bit of a sook BUT for recreational purposes I see no reason to fly where you cannot land.

[RickE]

Thanks a lot for the update Allan, as an MTO sport/Rotax owner I am hoping that a definite cause can be found. Unfortuneatley for us folk that live on the coast flying over tiger country is something that we don"t go looking for but is inevitable due to the topography of our local area.I would also have to agree with Paul that myself and I am sure many others are becoming over confident with the reliability of our rotax engines. On a recent trip I spent a couple of hours over the snowy mountains with very few options had there been a problem.Having said that I would also add that when I fly in inhospitable locations I realize and accept the associated risks.

[chook]

Paul- agreed.Those who have had engine outs tend to fly a different flight profile than those who haven"t had an engine out. And yes these "new" machines I am sure are giving people a false sense of security. There is nothing like the silence of an ea81 in glide mode to get your attention and make a lasting impression.Remember - "we have never left one up there"!Chook.

[birdy]

many others are becoming over confident with the reliability of our rotax engines.Over 6000 hours without so much asa coff could to do that, but I don"t trust it.And I always have carb heat on.

[Brian]

Thanks a lot for the update Allan, as an MTO sport/Rotax owner I am hoping that a definite cause can be found. Unfortuneatley for us folk that live on the coast flying over tiger country is something that we don"t go looking for but is inevitable due to the topography of our local area.I would also have to agree with Paul that myself and I am sure many others are becoming over confident with the reliability of our rotax engines. On a recent trip I spent a couple of hours over the snowy mountains with very few options had there been a problem.Having said that I would also add that when I fly in inhospitable locations I realize and accept the associated risks.Rick, is there carby heat installed on your gyro ? is it an option or standard ?

[Brian]

I have a few difernt thoughts about flying over country / water where a normal landing is not possible.1. The new generation gyros are reasonably / very reliable, we have seen quite a few around Australai & cross country from here to there without any ground support. This wasnt the case not all that long ago except for isolated cases.2. In the above case, the passenger asked to have a look at where the big bushfires went through a few yeas ago & the pilot, who is quite expereinced agreed to the request. The pilot lives in the area and would have been well aware of the country he was going to overfly and, given the reliabilty of the MTO / rotax engines, he probably had every right to believe that such a flight could be done in a high degree of safety.3. Should restrictions be imposed on the carriage of passengers over tiger country ? & if so, how could that policy be policed ? My first reaction was to bring in some form of restrictions on where passengers can be taken but the more I think about it, I reckon we just have to rely on the PIC to make the correct call. Having said that, I definately believe that all carbied engines should have some form of carby heat that works. [ not saying that carby ice was a cause of this incident]

[RickE]

G,day Brian,I own two gyros that are both powered by 914 turbo motors and my understanding is that the air intake on the 914 motors is heated through the air box making carb icing less likely.Your comment in regard to carrying passengers over tiger country is a good one as I do this fairly regularly around home and do a fair bit of X country with my wife and others. I am not sure what the answer is there other than personal responsibility both from the pilot and passengers point of view.One thing that surprises me is that fixed wing pilots flying Rotax powered aircraft seem to be a lot more relaxed flying over tiger country than gyro pilots with the same power plants.Appreciate your point of view.

[Justin]

I would give any

[birdy]

A 4banger rotax is as reliable as your likely to get any piston engine.Wot stops them is poor installation.No engine is ammunition to this.Ice. Dirty fuel.Water or vapor lock.Lac of maintenance. Tho I"ve seen sum very neglected ones still dutifully pushing the idiot around.Age Poor ventilation/cooling.Poor oil temp regulation.Thay are the same Asa horse, if you abuse it, you deserved the kick in the head.