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Ground angle of tail dragger Gyro

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  • Ground angle of tail dragger Gyro

    Does anyone know the best angle for a tail dragger gyro sitting on the ground? Can it be more than 9 degrees (if the head only has 9 degrees of forward travel)?Daryl Patterson

  • #2
    I think, solong as a full forward stick has the rotorbolt virtical or even a degree or two past, and the full back stick dosen't have the rotor hit'n anythn, you pretty right.The greater the back tilt the more air you can ram into the blades to spin um up.Like i said, 'i think', i don't know coz i'v never seen one let alone built one.Ignorance is bliss............but only till you realise you were.You can always get the answer you want, if you ask enough experts.

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    • #3
      Daryl,Suggest you google up Kellet and Pitcairn Gyros, also Ron Herron's little wing as well as the pitbull gyro [North American Rotorwerks] - they were tail draggers, some nice pictures too.Cheers,Nick.

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      • #4
        In his handling notes Ron Herron specifies that the Little Wing takes off in the three point attitude. I understand this point was missed by some who have assumed the tail should be lifted as with a fixed wing. The consequences of this are well known.This brings me a dilemma if I put mine on floats, it needs to be in the three point attitude for T/O and LDG, but in the normal relationship between fuselage and floats for cruise, looks like I need an adjustable rear strut to accomplish this.In the one he built with elevator for pitch control there was apparently a problem with rotor control after landing into the wind, as the tail dropped after a wheels LDG the disc AoA increased unless the machine was turned side on so the disc could be flattened to the wind.John EvansThink logically and do things well, think laterally and do things better.

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        • #5
          John,For those of us who do know, could you please explain what does happen?Thank you,Nick.

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          • #6
            Thank you for the replies. I think Birdy is right in that the rotor disc should be able to travel approx 2 degrees forward of horizontal. The reason for my enquiry is that I often read that a rotor head has a movement of 9 deg fore and aft, and I can't find anything that says I can't have more. I think if I have a ground angle of, say, 10 deg I want a forward tilt of at least 12 deg. Is there any reason why not?Daryl Patterson

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            • #7
              Yes Daryl I think Birdy summed it up.Nick, I assume you mean those who don't know? If so which bits are you interested in?John EvansThink logically and do things well, think laterally and do things better.

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              • #8
                Download Attachment: [img]icon_paperclip.gif[/img] Head Movement.doc88.54

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                • #9
                  Thanks Tim. The notes in the little wing plans say a similar thing, except sitting on the ground. I'm still assuming that at a mimimum, the rotor disc would have to be at least horizontal with the stick fully forward and all the wheels on the ground. Otherwise things could get exciting really quickly! My problem is as always, that I am building something not quite the same as most others and I dont have the Gyro flying expeirience yet. In a nut shell "I don't know what I don't know", so I appreciate all the help I can get.Daryl Patterson

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                  • #10
                    Daryl..What are you building??Nick.

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                    • #11
                      The short answer is a side by side developement of an short frame Littlewing. What drives me nuts (amoungst other things) is that it has approximately the same performance as a Patcairn PA22 (without the jump take off). They were designed over 70 years ago. So much for progress!Image Insert: 18.21

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                      • #12
                        Hi DarylLooking forward to seeing your machine fly.Considering your not yet licenced to fly gyro's, your doing realy well. And after seeing your SE5 in the flesh I'm sure this little gyro will be a thing of beauty.I know we have spoken about your side by side configuration, and still feel its the way to go !!!!!(double thumbs up).I wouldnt worry about comparing the Pitcairn PA22 with yours, as in my opinion, a gyro's performance is about 70% blades, and the PA 22 has 3. Regards Sam.

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                        • #13
                          Hi Sam. The point I wanted to make is that sometime I feel that I have to reinvent the wheel, so to speak. Nothing I am doing is new. It's a little bit different to most, but nothing that hasn't been done before. I feel certain that all the information I need is well known within the Australian Gyro comunity. But most gyro people don't participate in this forum and when I ask why not almosts everyone to a man said the exact same thing, using the exact same words. "Too many idiots"(that people is a quote).I'm an unknown in Gyro's. When this plane is flying I won't need to say much, the Gyro will say it all.Image Insert: 45.32

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                          • #14
                            Looking great Daryl, and I love the tanks, and there positioning.Down low, and right under the C of G with the pilot and passenger.What will you do with the mains, will they be located and positioned similar to the LW.I have seen that most vintage Gyro's had there mains positioned just behind the engine, but the LW has them located similar to a FW.I beleive its to do with Roll ratio's, but must admit, I dont understand them.Regards Sam.

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                            • #15
                              Similar to fixed wing under carriage. The good thing about coming into Gyro's without knowing any Gyro pilots first is that I can look at every thing with a fresh prospective. I'm not burdend with the inflexable thinking of some. Makes for a more efficient Gyro I think, time will tell. Just hope Birdy doesn't find out the 912S has gone to the top of the engine wish list! Doh!!!Daryl Patterson

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