laws n logic

[Brian]

Give it to them, David! ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D He doesnt need any encouragment

[birdy]

For heavans sake lad, you know the laws etc relating to the registration /liscencing relating to gyros probably better than me.Well, i thort i did, but im getn the feeln i dont.I thort i could do all me bore runs n mustern n wotever and not be breakn any rules, solong as i dont get payed for it by sumone.Too bad Birdy, you have been one of those "aviators" from the day you first flew.Im a simple gyro driver [ pilot] not an aviater. An aviater can navigate, talk air lingo and knows the air rules. I just fly it and stay out of the aviaters way. There has been a few of those errant FW"ers been done for low flying so the law is working.And they are the lucky ones, the unlucky ones dont get caught, they get killed.

[asra]

Congratulations on your new purchase Birdy

[Brian]

For heavans sake lad, you know the laws etc relating to the registration /liscencing relating to gyros probably better than me.Well, i thort i did, but im getn the feeln i dont.I thort i could do all me bore runs n mustern n wotever and not be breakn any rules, solong as i dont get payed for it by sumone.Too bad Birdy, you have been one of those "aviators" from the day you first flew.Im a simple gyro driver [ pilot] not an aviater. An aviater can navigate, talk air lingo and knows the air rules. I just fly it and stay out of the aviaters way. There has been a few of those errant FW"ers been done for low flying so the law is working.And they are the lucky ones, the unlucky ones dont get caught, they get killed.I think I"ll have to get you and Mark Regan togther so you can work out the rules etc...Well, now, if you have a PPL commercial, a registered gyro, you are a member of ASRA, you get an AOC from CASA and a mustering endorsment from ASRA and a couple of other minor things....you are going to be legal to get paid......and you thought a PPL was a nuisance

[Brian]

Congratulations on your new purchase Birdy Not sure what Murray know"s but it might be time to come clean and let the world know Birdy.

[birdy]

Well, now, if you have a PPL commercial, a registered gyro, you are a member of ASRA, you get an AOC from CASA and a mustering endorsment from ASRA and a couple of other minor things....you are going to be legal to get paidI have no intention of do"n it for coin.Just want to do me own.How much of that list is needed to do me own, besides the gyro rego n licence?Not sure what Murray know"s but it might be time to come clean and let the world know Birdy.Thats 2 of us. ???Wot you talkn bout Muz??

[asra]

:-x
..........

[tonydenton]

is that blowing a kiss muzz?

[GraemeMonro]

is that blowing a kiss muzz? I think it is someone with their teeth out.Graeme.

[Brian]

Well, now, if you have a PPL commercial, a registered gyro, you are a member of ASRA, you get an AOC from CASA and a mustering endorsment from ASRA and a couple of other minor things....you are going to be legal to get paidI have no intention of do"n it for coin.Just want to do me own.How much of that list is needed to do me own, besides the gyro rego n licence?Not sure what Murray know"s but it might be time to come clean and let the world know Birdy.Thats 2 of us. ???Wot you talkn bout Muz??Okay, gyro reg & licence is all thats needed. The mustering endorsement is not needed to do your own moos. [will double check that bit but I thinks that only applied to those doing a commercil licence.] To clear things further, you can muster your cows on another property if you have them on agisted there etc. [anywhere in Australia]Common Muzz, what are you talking about ?? Its time to come clean.

[asra]

is that blowing a kiss muzz? No Tony,its lips sealed.

[asra]

I agree with you 100% BirdyI usually use the ppl knowledge to avoid the authoritiesJust wish I could service the cessna "Peoiple dont realize the amount of stuff down low to catch them out but most muster"s know all too well, thats why they stay alive."Would be a lot safer fw mutterers if they spend a few hours in a open frame gyro"To clear things further, you can muster your cows on another property if you have them on agisted there etc. [anywhere in Australia]That"s frikin" cool

[gyroo]

Hi Guys,Sorry to **** on a party, but I have to over-rule this quote: "To clear things further, you can muster your cows on another property if you have them on agisted there etc. [anywhere in Australia]"THIS IS WRONGCivil Aviation Order 95.12 Instrument 2011 section 5(c)(iii) reads: "aerial stock mustering conducted as a private operation, in accordance with CAO 29.10 or equivalent ASRA requirements, over land occupied by the owner of the gyroplane""Occupied" has an Australian legal meaning that usually requires an "occupier" to be in actual possession of an area with some regularity, continuity or permanence. It implies that the possession has a duration and as such can include contract visitors and customers who need to remain on land (and at the most extreme) even squatters and long-duration protesters. A caretaker, manager or other person in charge of the land can be an occupier while the employer or owner is not in occupation. Dual occupancy is also easily possible, where an owner and the owner"s manager can both be occupiers simultaneously. One measure of whether a person is an occupier will be to determine whether they have or had an ability to exclude others using lawful means, and this suggests that if the land owner knows the another person is occupying their land with their permission then the land owner would normally be expected to back up the other person as being an occupier. Shooters who have express approval by the landowner to camp on a station property would generally fall just within the definition of occupier, whereas unauthorised campers would have less of a claim to assert that they are an occupier. The possession needs to be current - if a person is not currently in some form of possession they aren"t an occupier. Generally, the possession will need to be more than transitory.In summary - a caretaker has a very strong claim of occupation; a bore driller working on a property for days or weeks on end with the express approval of the owner would be deemed an occupier; a birdwatcher camping on a property with the owner"s permission for a week or so would probably also squeek into the definition of occupier; an unauthorised spotlight shooter would not be regarded as an occupier; a protester from the "Occupy" movement might assert they have a right to occupy a public space, but public authorities will generally have the law on their side in ruling that protesters in public spaces are not occupiers.The concept of "occupier" CANNOT be stretched to cover a situation where 1000 head of your livestock (or livestock the management of which has been entrusted to you) have wandered onto an adjoining property not owned by you or onto Crown Land and where you are flying around trying to locate and muster them. Even if the livestock are on the adjoining land under some sort of agistment arrangement with the landowner, that still won"t make a gyro pilot who owns the agisting livestock flying over the adjoining land an "Occupier".If authorities were moving to prosecute a particular gyro pilot for illegal mustering, the first thing prosecutors would check would be the nature of the relationship the gyro pilot has with the landowner. If the landowner knows or knew that the gyro pilot is or was present on his or her land operating from the land, camping on the land, and undertaking tasks associated with the property, then it might be possible for a competent defence lawyer to successfully argue to a court that the gyro pilot was an "occupier" (and therefore possibly even deter a prosecution from being attempted in the first place). On the other hand, if the landowner knew nothing about the gyro pilot flying over his land, then it is extremely unlikely the landowner would back up the gyro pilot and the authorities would have an easier task of sheeting home a successful prosecution (making it MORE likely that they will launch a prosecution in the first place).Mark ReganASRA Board member & CASA Liaison Officer

[Brian]

Thanks Mark for straightening up that issue, I had it wrong.

[birdy]

Im not real good at taken in law stuff like this, kinda boils the cells.But am i readn it rite, that even if i have the "occupiers" permission, and am not recieven any coin reward, im still in the ****?