x-Files

[blakemorem]

Before we gaze into the galaxies far beyond we haven"t even fully understood our own planet. The secrecy of technologies born to the industrial revolution only two hundred years old. The secrecy of our own society like the Illuminati. The deliberate deceptions to inhibit our awareness of technologies and our own origins. If we considered we were the only planet of billions that supported life we have succumbed to our own naivety. The crop circles although being contaminated by pranksters of skill get you thinking, are they all man made. The ancient stone patterns in South Africa are worthy of some investigation. As Birdy said about the pyramids is true as improvisation and determination also the masses of men devoted to their king will move rocks of 1000 tonne. Even to carve a rock a peasant well spend most of his life bashing a channel with a hand rock day in day out, (familiar) such the dedication to their ruler. As Muz mentioned also how did the Mayans have such advanced knowledge of astronomy. I don"t believe every thing i read but there is indeed a lot to think about. The origin of galaxies would give age to planets far beyond the 4.5 billion years of earth so their technology could be thousands or millions of years past our humble industrial steam engines and combustible engine, five speed, rubber tired, 4 door, adjustable steering, driver stability control, etc etc really is this the best we can do... Surely not, you only have to step out of the Gyro into a car to feel how primitive the motor vehicle is. I wonder how fast we will advance when the oil runs out. Mike.

[birdy]

"Need" blake, is the mother. Rite now, there is no need, so no invention. ( nun that see the lite of day anyway.)Too much coin with the status quo.Oil run,n out is nuthn.The realisation that there are too many people will be wen things change.Not to mention the air pump getn bogged in bog.

[MadMuz]

The oil is definitely running out, but the oil companies and gubbamints have too much invested in keeping us cash cows paying up..... The oil companies are miles ahead of us tho, they know (and have bought technologies) that will replace oil when it becomes to scarce or hard to find.... but they will have something to "sell" us when that happens.Just to clarify my point on ancient peoples knowing about astronomy so precisely..... how could a Myan (for example) know that the little white twinkly dots in the night sky were actually stars and planets.... as in spheres that orbit the sun.... how did they identify them without optical assistance (telescopes)

[johnc]

Check this pilot out ......... http://www.stumbleupon.com/su/2yl1Nq...Xvo%2F&noapp=1

[birdy]

Just to clarify my point on ancient peoples knowing about astronomy so precisely.People have bin maken amaznly accurate measurements centries before the brain killn gps turned up.( out ere, most people wouldnt hava clue where north is)A simple example.This goanner farm was surveyed back in the 1930s.The guvment surveyer placed cement markers every 10 mile or so along the bounderys, and one in every corner.The accuracy along our north boundery is within 6"-12". The pgs cant get any closer.Thats over a 60km strech, over virgin desert country.Me bloody gps is only accurate within 3".Duno wot he used, but it wasnt a gps, the line wasnt cleared and all he had wasa few horses.Snot rocket science.Also not hard to imgine them buildn piramids and scratchn pictures on the rock.

[MadMuz]

I know the 1900"s seems prehistoric Birdy, but I mean thousands of years ago....iron age etc. Since about the 17th century people have been able to navigate and position things with precision, but if the people of the world believed the earth was flat 5000 years ago, what did they think the stars in the sky were? The only thing that might make them think they are round planets, is because they could see the moon is round. But my point is how could they identify individual stars and track them for a year to know they are in exactly the same position without telescopes even? I think they must have had some sort of "assistance"

[mad max]

Personally, I think we had a pre-history. Civilisations long before the last ice age. Prob. destroyed in a natural disaster. Some evidence has been dug up but the archaeological culture is such that if you mention it you"re clasified as a nutter and have trouble getting a job. Airline pilots have lost their jobs in the past reporting UFO"s. There has been many reincarnation reports over thousands of yrs. similar to Johnc"s story. The trouble is many doctrinated religions say reincarnation is wrong so the leaders can maintain power over their subjects. In Christianity for e.g. J.C used to mention reincarnation. In the 5th century a group of priests in the absence of the pope removed any reference to it. J.C.was a great bloke, but it"s man who turned his preaching into a packaged monstrosity.

[RickE]

Just to clarify my point on ancient peoples knowing about astronomy so precisely.People have bin maken amaznly accurate measurements centries before the brain killn gps turned up.( out ere, most people wouldnt hava clue where north is)A simple example.This goanner farm was surveyed back in the 1930s.The guvment surveyer placed cement markers every 10 mile or so along the bounderys, and one in every corner.The accuracy along our north boundery is within 6"-12". The pgs cant get any closer.Thats over a 60km strech, over virgin desert country.Me bloody gps is only accurate within 3".Duno wot he used, but it wasnt a gps, the line wasnt cleared and all he had wasa few horses.Snot rocket science.Also not hard to imgine them buildn piramids and scratchn pictures on the rock.Birdy, If you ever get the opportunity to read about Len Beadell and the work he did in the outback surveying and building roads well before gps it"s truly an amazing story.

[JAL]

Just to clarify my point on ancient peoples knowing about astronomy so precisely.People have bin maken amaznly accurate measurements centries before the brain killn gps turned up.( out ere, most people wouldnt hava clue where north is)A simple example.This goanner farm was surveyed back in the 1930s.The guvment surveyer placed cement markers every 10 mile or so along the bounderys, and one in every corner.The accuracy along our north boundery is within 6"-12". The pgs cant get any closer.Thats over a 60km strech, over virgin desert country.Me bloody gps is only accurate within 3".Duno wot he used, but it wasnt a gps, the line wasnt cleared and all he had wasa few horses.Snot rocket science.Also not hard to imgine them buildn piramids and scratchn pictures on the rock.It was pain staking work that does your head in. I was fortunate enough to be the transition generation and got to do it both ways (not on horse back but using nicely equipped tojos) . I can tell you 3 feet with GPS is close enough compared to try and get within 3 inches with a theodolite.The guy would have done with a chain, theodolite and thermometer and he would have done it twice there and back (to close off the survey)

[johnc]

It"s science time.....what"s conciousness, where do the laws of physics come from, why do we sleep, what"s gravity, what is the origin of life and....how does a bicycle work, even....what is the dimensions of a country"s coastline?

[MadMuz]

The Romans used to do their surveying quite accurately with the wooden "Groma" thing like a hat stand or small clothesline type thing on a pole with strings and weights (plumb bobs).... siting along the strings and directing slaves with poles, like we do with theodolites and the pole man. Evidently, the Greeks and Egyptions used them even before the Romans.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groma_surveying

[mad max]

Wow Johnc, You"re well versed in Pholosophy, science, theology, I"m impressed. You can join the campfire discussion under the stars with Mike and me. We"ll have to stay off the drugs, the topic is too important "Fly by the seat of your pants" A great way to go through life.

[blakemorem]

I have always thought outside the square,call it intuition or madness don"t care but here"s an example, when i studied atomic theory i noticed how every thing (Atoms) wanted to become equal in state like displacement of electrons always become equal in the potential difference, look at Kerchoff"s law basically when it equals zero you are correct. But how an atom maintains it"s atomic number is truly amazing. It has protons Neutrons and electrons orbiting around the valence shell. Pending on the number of protons and electrons makes the Element. You see this molecular bonding and equilibrium every where and Good old Einsteins theory of every action has an equal and opposite reaction and you cannot create or destroy matter it finds equilibrium some where else. It may take some time like isotopes but it will happen. May be this is the answer. Give matter of the universe enough time it may become one element. Then BANG it starts all over again. The magic of the atom"s proton / neutron, what makes the opposite attract,and why do electrons orbit and why do protons spin. A magnet is a mega example of atomic opposition and attraction and gravity but why, well the young Einsteins are breaking atoms apart and finding these mysterious energy"s and yes dark energy, no mysteries just atomic theory, magnets aren"t magic. Nothing has to be a mystery just an ability to understand what we are looking at. I ain"t no genius but i know there is a lot out there we don"t understand yet.And the conventional theories may be wrong too.Mike.

[birdy]

"Fly by the seat of your pants" A great way to go through life.There is anatha way????

[johnc]

But is it fun???