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Hmmmmmm,Im not letting the cat out of the bag just yet Baz.M Barker
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Murray,Go on, spill your guts....Nick.
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John,I recall seeing the prop on one of Dave Gittens' gyros - the 'Ikenga' tractor gyro.It had alternate wood and carbon fibre layers, ie, an epoxy/carbon fibre binder for each laminate. This may be useful.West Epoxy Systems have some great books out on their adhesives and construction techniques, worth a look at FMS (Fibreglass Material Supplies) West Gosford.Cheers,Nick.
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Hey John the greenies [^] and their[
] termite mates will be after you and your machine[
]. Will be very interested in your progress with this different aproach to construction materials. Are you going for wood rotors as well? Good building Des Garvin.
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John,Progress pictures please!Cheers,Nick.
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regarding wheel location, you may want to study martin hollmann's comments in Modern Gyroplane Design about how most of the early tractor gyros were destroyed by rollover when wheels were placed that allowed a toosmall rollover angle. pictures of the pitbull or littlewing tractor planes might show an example of what seems to work?? as i recall the precription was wide mainwheels very close to the mast axis but what would protect from a front rollover??billshamblin
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John,Hi. What's the latest news regarding your tractor gyro? I'm building one too, and thought it might be nice to find out where you have progressed to with yours.Cheers,DuncanAUckland, NZ
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Progress is slow at the moment Duncan as I've been distracted with modifications to the Red monster -3' hub bar and trying to use throttle body fuel injection, that's just about all hooked up, next I'll see if I can start it by hand - no starter.So the tractor is just sitting there. I've got the landing gear half organised using three front springs out of a Nissan Nomad. Once I've got it sitting on all three wheels I'll work on the engine mount for the Mazda rotary.Where are you up to?John EvansThink logically and do things well, think laterally and do things better.
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John,Thanks for the report. I am just at the beginning, unfortunately. Actually, I shouldn't say "unfortunately" because this is tremendous fun.I decided to build a Sonex, and bought the plans. Then I bought all the sheet 6061 required, and started cutting and hacking away at it. However, I have always been secretly fascinated (obsessed?) by gyros, and couldn't stop researching them on the web. That's when I discovered the Gyrobee. Shortly afterwards, I discovered the Hornet, and within a few days, decided that because they were ultralights, I would have to settle for (1) single seat (2) 2-stroke engine. Neither appealed to me, and I began looking at 2-seaters. This led me to consider the Little Wing, and I half-decided that I would lay the Sonex aside, and begin building a LW.That's when the thought struck me that I might be able to take a great deal from the Sonex (since I already had the plans) and design my own tractor gyro around it. This is what I have done. A great deal of the internals, control linkages, dimensions etc are taken directly from the Sonex. Even the fusalage owes a great deal to the Sonex. But I have taken it a step further, and designed what I think might be a really nice tractor gyro, with a cantilevered mast angling forward, a sexy looking fuselage and with stub wings as an integral part of the design. The wingtips can be removed, and full high aspect ratio wings fitted should I decide to go down that path.I'll be powering it with a Renesis engine, built for me by Tom Wickers of Cobra Aviation (Melbourne).You can check out my progress at my website: http://rtfmsoft.com/tgNice to have made contact. What about a few photos of your project?Regards,Duncan
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Duncan, had a look at your site, tried to enrol, stuffed it up as usual,[].Good to see you're using a Renesis engine. Are you aware of the ACRE site run by Paul Lamar? They are doing a lot of work converting them to peripheral port.I am using a 12A Turbo, for which I've bought a reduction box and engine management system from Tracy Crook.I'm intrigued with your slanting the mast forward. Don't you think it would be better sloping back from near the firewall and landing gear? lift and drag forces would then be exerting tension on it instead of bending, also you would then be putting the major forces into the major strong points, instead of having to strengthen the empenage to handle them. What standards apply to building 2 seaters in the Shaky Isles? We have a set of standards derived from BCAR section T. Some of the more impossible requirements were watered down, but there are still some which need to be dealt with.John EvansThink logically and do things well, think laterally and do things better.
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John,Hi. I'll double-check the RTFM forum just to make sure it wasn't me who stuffed up.Yes, I follow Paul Lamar's mailing list, but there's altogether too much p-port discussion, and I don't really know what it all means. Some day closer to the end of the project when I begin turning my attention to engines perhaps I'll discover the secrets of the p-port mystery, but till then, I'm quite content to let them discuss it till they get it right. I've done the web site for Cobra Aviation for about a year now, and am building up quite a lot of credit with Tom. So when the time comes to invest in the noisy bit, I'm hoping to score a good deal. The engine he favours in the Arrow is the Renesis, so that's probably what I'll get.As far as the mast is concerned, the thinking was to keep the mast out of pilot view. Having decided that a cantilevered mast would do that, I triangulated it, and discovered that in doing so (with very little weight penalty) I ended up with an incredibly rigid and strong mast. Even at 6Gs, the gyro weight will only be just on 2000kg, and the mast will cope with that easily. Under normal (S&L) flight, the mast will be bearing only about 350kg. Well, that's the theory, anyway.I got in contact with Tony Hansen (our CAA guy in charge of Ultralight Class 1 - ie Gyros), and he sent me all the regs. We also base our certification on the British BCAR section T, but our CAA seems to use it as a guideline only, and seem far more sensible in implementing some of its harsher bits.I spent some time in the workshop over the weekend trying to mock-up the 1" tubing I'll be using for the airframe. I was working in 1" wood, and just as well. My first attempt was a complete ballsup. The second attempt was better, and served to highlight the fact that I was using WAY too much tubing. I studied the pictures on Skyguynca's website (http://www.skyguynca.com/tg.html) and redesigned the frame to use about a third less tubing. So this weekend, I'll try version 3 of the frame. If this goes according to plan, I'll then try to marry the frame with the 2x2 load bearing structure (ie keel + triangulated mast) and see what it looks like. Then I'll take a few photos.Regards,Duncan
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Duncan, I used to own and fly a Sonex. Loved it very much. Too bad your not building yours cause it would be a real fun plane if it turned out anything like my old one.just my two cents
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