Wow!!!!! All gone quiet......

[asra]

Good report Paul. With questions like Davids, don"t forget that should a group (of considerable numbers) decide to take the RAA route, you will have bargaining power for a sunset clause on current conditions (that"s if they have different rules). i.e. any one who goes across keeps what they"ve got. Newcomers may have to step up to a slightly different set of rules. What newbies haven"t had, they won"t miss.Does that make sense?

[Tim]

When talking about joining the RAAus, consider this - with their 5000 members and our 500, we would have only one tenth the say in what happens, so we could be comfortably out-voted in all issues. We would also receive a quantum leap in Gyro registration fees. We would also loose our Government grant, which I am sure the RAA would be happy to accept.What about our fatality rate this year? It would probably be easier to ground us until it is sorted out. We would be out-voted on that one too.There probably would be advantages in joining the RAA but it would not necessarily be in "weight in numbers". Do you really think that they would fight for us if it came to the crunch, considering that we would be a very small part in a big organisation. They would have to look after number 1 first and you couldn"t blame them for that.

[asra]

When someone invites you over, you don"t get together with a bunch of your mates and walk in with a list of demands!!!!!Sorry Woz. Not talking about going over to one of my mates places. Strictly business transaction. More like "get 12 of your mates and go down to the Toyota dealership and say you want to buy 12 new cars". And then tell them your headin to the Nissan joint next. See what happens. Its called fleet buying. My experience is that its good for at least 25%. We got something to sell (increase in membership). We"re just haggling over the price. Ask RAA what its worth to swell their membership by 10% in one hit. G"day Tim,I read you. And on face value, I wouldn"t dream of joining on the basis of 1/10th of the vote. But something that"s always puzzled me is that for some reason, if some-on spuds in (even though he"s not registered/licensed/member of ASRA), we still seem to cop the statistic. I wouldn"t expect that RAA would see it that way. This is all good healthy debate. If we have a repeat of this years board problems, we mightn"t have anything to fight with either. If you read back thru the thread, Paul suggested that RAA might be an option. So is CASA. So is ASRA. If we go back 20 years we didn"t have an ASRA, and the formation of it was resisted by many. A couple of weeks ago, we may have technically not existed. Under incorporation (IIRC), we need a Pres, Vice Pres, Sec & Treas. to function. The last couple of years, ASRA progressed in leaps and bounds. This year, it is like we jumped off a cliff. "We is merely discussing options". We don"t all have to take the same option, but it would be good if we could. But we should all look at the options, even if only to make ASRA a better place and to learn from the happenings of the last year.On another note, I see that Adrian is the only one to respond to Pauls question of who has withdrawn their nominations.Cheers

[Russell]

Asra ain"t dead..........taken a bit of a thumpin tho..........Let"s get new faces on board, give em support, and get asra "pumping" again.Be buggered if i want to be a minnow in he RAA fish pond. [ 5000 them........500 us ]Christ, they"ll eat us up and spit out the bones.

[asra]

I"m gunna have to agree with you, Woz. I don"t wanna be wrong

[Dewie]

The RAA is made up of several minnows to form a collective pond, Ultralights,Trikes, powered parachutesWhen ever a Trike goes in they dont ground all trikes do they, These people arent idiots! They run the joint in a professional manner and very successfully as well.Well put Ozy

[Russell]

Asra ain"t dead..........taken a bit of a thumpin tho..........Let"s get new faces on board, give em support, and get asra "pumping" again.Be buggered if i want to be a minnow in he RAA fish pond. [ 5000 them........500 us ]Christ, they"ll eat us up and spit out the bones.Geeeeezis

[asra]

Hello everyone,I have lurked for a long time on this forum and have thought that becoming part of RAA would be more of a positive than a negative. I hold a ppl, a recreational pilots license and a student gyroplane license. I decided, to cut costs and let my ppl lapse as I mostly fly a skyfox gazelle and have bought my own gyro. I think that there would be many people who could be converted to gyroplane flying if it was under the stewardship of the RAA. I would imagine that there would be less mucking about for people like me, who like fixed and rotary aircraft, simplifying the process of conversion, reducing cost and form filling. I reckon that the same thing should happen with private pilots licenses coming under the RAA. At the moment There are too many small organizations which if amalgumated must cut down on admin costs. The bigger the organisation the larger say we all will have. It seems a no brainer to me, except for the legitimate point that was made about RAA insisting on factory built aircraft for training.

[aussie_paul]

I have that from a number of people who have to pay RAA and ASRA etc. These people it seems would welcome the merger.I am still quietly listening to all being said, trying to work out which will be the best for gyros into the next decade or two of our evolution. Some good points coming from quite a few peoplke on and off line.Keep at the think tanking.I spent an enjoyable hour on the phone a couple of nights ago with Waddles talking about our new machines as well as a little politics. The part 149 having been gazetted or about to be gives another light to the subject.Aussie Paul.

[Russell]

Here"s one out from left field...................Waddles "President"..............he then selects "his team" to sort this mess, and take us forward.This is one guy that has my respect and admiration. [ the jewel in asra"s crown ]........sorry Al.

[Greg Mitchell]

Now Now Russell,I"m not sure that would be possible under the relevant acts, by laws and Constitution. I"d like to say IMHO, if Allan Wardill were to nominate he would get my vote and I believe a majority of the membership through association with Allan, would indeed put their votes to Allan for selection to the board.Given that were to eventuate, I would then hope that any newly elected board would have the "nouse", (common sense) to

[Brian]

Good interesting debate happening and thats good.Pleased to hear that the members are going to get a chance to have a vote with a reasonably clear idea of whats happening and happened.The way I see it is that its crucial who is elected or not elected at this election as another year like the last might well see the end of ASRA so ring around like Mitch has suggested and ask the difficult questions.Great to hear the good progress Mitch !!

[Greg Mitchell]

G"Day Brian,You"re back Mate, good. Cheers,Mitch.

[Russell]

Brian..........not quite accurate. It"s just the "net" members [ forum guys ] that have seen what has been going on, the whole screamin match. That"s tops....100 members.That leaves another 300 plus that only get the magazine, and none of the full details, none of the "net" members views will be known to them. The ins and outs, the skullduggery getting played out.So....................come election time, there is the very real possibility, that those 300 odd members will revote back in the "waring" parties, oblivious of the recent turmoils.This outcome is in my view near on guaranteed. Somehow this has to be avoided, otherwise we have all endured this public humiliation of asra all for nothing.We need a "new team"........no recycling of the "foes". The easiest way i see to get through this, would be for the 2 parties to not seek re election, let the dust settle.So please, the Evans, the McClures, how about for the good of asra, you both now step back........please.Both parties will go to their graves, hating the other party. Some members are right now indicating, that if there is a recycling.........they are done with asra. Already 2 avenues of "alternatives" have been explored.RAA and the other is the "parellel path" both options very achievable. Splintering asra is so wrong, so come on you "foes" think of asra here.......pleaseI"m done.............

[asra]

or for a few dollars you could design and promote a flyer/ promotional sheet within the Gyro News so that it reaches everybody who is a member.The Flyer/ promotional sheet needs to be informative, eyecatching and give a clear positive outcome to what the group behind the