Double amputee Solo in RAF 2000

[birdy]

Training is intense, pilots do about 50 hours before they go soloBloodyell, 50 hours.Sounds like a very good reason to NOT get one.

[Brian]

Quote " readers have gained an impression that I hold the view that the RAF 2000 design is a relic of the past and should be relegated to the past, then you"re absolutely right. The RAF 2000 design, in my humble opinion, is the least worthy of all 2 seat designs on the Australian register, and I look forward to the remaining 6 quietly fading away, hopefully with no further casualties." Mark ReganIt amazes me why as well

[t-bird]

Mark just to correct you on the accident in the USA with 13 year old. The pilot did NOT have a passenger endorsement.

[MadMuz]

My comments were all based on the information being a "stock" RAF, which I have flown in as a passenger.... once.... to me "stock" means a tiny single fin, narrow beam axel and no HS. I have never flown in an RAF with a stock tail and stabilator.... and I am afraid I wouldn"t want to

[gyroo]

Mark just to correct you on the accident in the USA with 13 year old. The pilot did NOT have a passenger endorsement.

[eigyro]

There are no prizes or safety benefits in solo-ing early.The glider fraternity only solo their students quite late in the training process, a system that seems to work very well indeed.If the total training time is about 70 hours, which is about the international average for recreational aviation, what difference if the pilot soloes at10 hours or 50 hours ?While I have no love for the RAF2000, it does, so far, appear to be operating more safely in SAF than it has ever done elsewhere.I would attribute that mostly to the stabilator, but it is possible that a radically different approach to training could also have a beneficial effect.And before you shoot down this alternative training method, consider the general safety record of gyros by the "normal" method, not good.Gyros would benefit from a little less testosterone and a little more thought.Or less balls, more brains.I have never felt comfortable with the "how many hours to solo" question. Seems to me like a baited trap.

[MadMuz]

The most important thing about soloing at a reasonably short time, is the instructors job with a student is to prepare the student to fly their machine safely by themselves..... if the student has flown 50 hours with an instructor prior to solo, he has done all of these hours and developed habits knowing the instructor is there to help.... imo, the shortest time a student has to have the instructor there, the better.... the sooner the student gets to learn to do the right thing with no one watching over him/her....It has nothing to do with who has big balls or not..... it is all about how well people can adapt to the 3rd dimension of flying..... some people are hard to teach and some can"t be taught to fly at all. When I learned to fly it was in a group of other students (a school group) and out of 6 of us only 3 continued flying.... one guy was only able to listen to the instructor, but didn"t really learn to do it himself. I remember the instructor saying that he had the guy line up, start the roll and Wally (the instructor) just sat there in the right seat and watched.... they got to lift off speed, over lift off speed, the end piano keys, off the end of the runway.... the student was looking out the front, waiting for Wally to tell him what to do

[eigyro]

I wonder do the trainers of the tandem machines in South Africa follow the same "late solo" philosophy ?If I was learning to fly something bog-stable, I would think an early solo is fair enough.If learning to fly a relatively twitchy machine, I can see the argument for a later solo.That said, the U.S. approach of just sticking a decent stab on it made a major improvement.I suspect the stabilator has made a similar improvement in South Africa, whatever one thinks of the methodology.

[eigyro]

Regarding solo, and when one soloes, the following, lifted today from PPRUNE, is a good example of the mental garbage this issue seems to generate;"Forgive me if this is out of order. I"ve currently got 13.7 hours in my logbook in the Cessna 162 Skycatcher, and today was supposed to be the day of my first solo.We landed after what I thought was a crap flight, and was told the inevitable: you aren"t going solo today, Alexander. I was then told that my rudder work needs work on final approach.My mind"s telling me that I"m now a crappy pilot, even though it was quite bumpy this morning. Considering I"ve dropped my Law degree to follow the aviation path, does not going solo the first time around mean I"m a bad pilot? "See what I mean?

[t-bird]

Mark you can not condone flying with out a license on an open forum as an ASRA board member. The PILOT will induce oscillations in a RAF without proper training. Adequate training will reduce the fatality rate as proven by RAFSA.Eigyro the average solo time on tandems are between 15 and 30 hours. It also depends if you are training at a controlled airport. Some pilots struggle with the Radio work.Murray I don"t think you have flown in a stock Raf.

[asra]

I will comment on my brief RAF experience,for what its worth.The first flight I had was with Paul Bruty at the first Coonamble nationals,I had about 400 hours at the time and I was a basic instructor.I was glad PB was on board as It went into slight airframe oscillation pretty much straight away.It wasn"t PIO as I was doing nothing but holding the stick still.From memory it was factory standard RAF.I was used to flying CLT machines with horizontal stabs. In other words sitting there fat dumb and happy,not having to do much.The second time was at Caboolture when PB was teaching Waddles to fly his brand new RAF.We had convinced Allan to put the horizontal stab that PB was selling on his RAF before solo.The HS made a huge difference I thought .Allan soloed in 6 hours.(ok yes he did have over 20,000 hrs fixed wing at the time!)The third was in Paul Campbells machine fitted with the Stabulator and a keel mounted HS.I flew Paul"s from Caboolture to Watts Bridge airfield.The only time the stick was touched was take-off and landing. 30 nautical miles.But its not what you would call stable. Almost constant use of rudder to keep it going in the right direction and constant dipping and weaving. The Stabulator seemed to get it back on track somewhat.Its not what I would call steady,relaxing flight,and you have to be constantly on the ball.I"ve experienced what a RAF has to offer and don"t need to visit that again.

[gyroo]

The PILOT will induce oscillations in a RAF without proper training. OK

[eigyro]

Mark didn"t condone anything, and you know it.He pointed out that the illegality was not the cause of the accident, and you know that too.The more disingenuous if not downright dishonest the defence, the less likely it is to be convincing.The 15 to 30 hours before solo sounds about right for any reasonable aircraft.

[t-bird]

Murray Baker I agree with everything except that the gyro produce the oscillation.

[Disco]

Is there a difference between a passenger and a 60kg sandbag?